Charlie Rose

mike_eme  07/11/2012 03:31 AM Report

Watched Dexter Filkins interview tonight. His description of withdrawal from Afghanistan eerily reminescent of our exit from Cambodia. This is kind of what we do. We can't control or babysit those cops. Unfortunately, just as in Vietnam, a waste of money, a waste of human life, and simply, a waste.

Ann_V  05/03/2012 01:35 PM Report

I so enjoyed the rich and diverse knowledge of the Afghanistan situation, that you all shared. Many thanks, and a wonderful job done by all.

curious1aboutpol  04/15/2012 11:20 PM Report

Even in this very candid discussion the issue of Taliban funding facilitated by the Chinese through the Pakistanis was largely ignored. I understand the inflamatory nature of exploring this topic but the American public needs to recognize the collusion of this large nation state and what we're up against in Afganistan. China is working with the taliban and pakistan liked we worked with the Mujahadeen and the Pakistanis.

I postulate the change in attitude by the Pakistanis and the Chinese In early 2003 when violence in Afgahnistan escalated was due to the Iraq war. These nations percieved an imperialist agenda taking place by the united states and turned against us

SharkswithfrikingLazers  03/17/2012 03:47 AM Report

On the show the issue of water and the Afghanistan, Pakistan and Indian triangle was mentioned.

This shocked me:

Pakistani Editorial Says Nuclear War with India "Inevitable" as Water Dispute Continues

http://oilprice.com/Geopolitics/International/Pakistani-Editorial-Says-Nuclear-War-With-India-Inevita ble-As-Water-Dispute-Continues.html

Charlie--terrorism or natural resources?

SharkswithfrikingLazers  03/17/2012 03:39 AM Report

We heard about the Taliban--close to Pakistan but some light between them, we can work with the Taliban, the Taliban is weaker, the picture about the Taliban is more complicated than what we are getting . . .

Here is a clip you might enjoy--shows the Taliban in Houston--and as George Clooney told us this week--oil is always involved.

(4:26)

http://youtu.be/gDsq4et834E

SharkswithfrikingLazers  03/17/2012 03:27 AM Report

If Afghanistan has been corrupt from day one and the government is corrupt from top to bottom then you have to change the entire system.

This is not a military action. This is a Nation Building action.

It may take two generations to get it right, or if we are efficient, just 21 years (one generation).

See, we are half way home.

SharkswithfrikingLazers  03/17/2012 03:21 AM Report

'We are missing the point here—there is only one Afghan Battalion and that is 600 guys. It is too embarrassing. It is fiction for the Afghan army or the Afghan government to stand on its own.'

Well then, what a waste of blood and treasure. Does the military have a revolving door to the banking industry per chance?

SharkswithfrikingLazers  03/17/2012 03:17 AM Report

'Better to be a slave of a Master than a slave of a slave and Karzai’s a slave/puppet.'

Has our Muslim Battalion been deployed yet?

SharkswithfrikingLazers  03/17/2012 03:15 AM Report

'The Koran is the glue with seven different political parties. The Taliban has a deep religious commitment.'

Nailed it in a nutshell. Send in our Muslim Battalion please.

jason  03/15/2012 03:50 PM Report

Lara Logan is really weak. sophomoric. despite her long history of reporting in Afghanistan, her assessment continues to be superficial and lack of depth.

finalfantasytown  03/14/2012 08:25 PM Report

the dimension is fully opened, so successful. I cannot describe how exciting I am. I go for some wine.

blank  03/14/2012 06:55 PM Report

i'm telling you this is the best stuff on tv talk about reality television

http://www.charlierose.com/view/interview/12222

i tend to feel better when i write people messages and they don't write me back it doesn't upset me at all sometimes it's easy to just get the thought out and know what happens

it gives me the power and ability to focus on what i want to focus on

(took shower before writing last two paragraphs haven't finished watching show - 27:45)

kind of stressful for a minute

does it ever do anything other people are asking for too much and then so life is just you have to make the best of life there's no need to stress

so it's like just take things easy let things happen as they happen (to be in a stable situation so you can pursue comfortably recovery process (whatever that means i know i'm working on things but anything that seems dependent on somebody else coming through never comes through)

okay check this i watched the emotional brain one too (life is a serious situation it's no joke and people look at it like it's entertainment if that's what it is it's fine but when people blur the lines don't get surprised when it's seen as entertainment - usually people are not in the same situation they apply their situation to your situation and try to control you

or really they do nothing

nobody does what you want them to do

note: watch last 5 seconds 12pm middle of day

SharkswithfrikingLazers  03/14/2012 05:40 PM Report

Charlie, more panels like this please.

Civil with much disagreement.

SharkswithfrikingLazers  03/14/2012 05:38 PM Report

Lara, I like your expression here and your facial expressions when the camera caught you when someone else was talking.

You have the right stuff on this segment and I am still thinking about how you were violated in Egypt and hope you have healed mentally.

BENEZRAA  03/14/2012 04:03 PM Report

THEN AGAIN...

IF we are NOT in Afghanistan for justifiable purposes, if we are there by mistake, if we are the cause of problems there, if (in the extreme) we are there to encourage traffic in weapons, drugs, child molestation, prostitution, and slavery, THEN we should exit immediately from the region, making sure to bring all the "private contractors [mercenaries]" out with us.

BENEZRAA  03/14/2012 03:42 PM Report

(1) IS THERE STRATEGIC VALUE TO IMMINENT WITHDRAWAL? (2) BREAKING THE HABIT OF VIOLENCE

So much of the violence and corruption may be nothing more than the habits of same, become a way of life after decades of same. It stands to reason that one aspect of the value of occupation -- even if that may require that we utilize our draft registry to speedily bolster deployable troops in order to rest our current overly used forces -- may be to bring martial peace long enough to Afghanistan for it's people to begin to breathe again.

The region will adjust as best possible, whether we stay or depart. If we depart now, we may lose all opportunity to positively affect the region for decades. If we depart now, the people will remember that we are quitters, that we lack faith or fortitude. As they suffer in the near term, they will associate their suffering with our departure; they will loathe our name and our nation; they will remember our POTUS as the weak and thoughtless, cruel man, who snatched defeat from the jaws of victory.

Our POTUS should cease apologizing for our existence and should strengthen our commitment. The Afghans are not stupid. They understand war far more than the average 99% of Americans, who are disenfranchised from what should be their own military responsibility, who are far more concerned about a few more pennies tacked onto the price of a gallon of gasoline, then they are concerned about the need for peace in Afghanistan. The Afghans will forgive us our trespasses, as long as they know without doubt just where we stand, and as long as they know that we do not stand on feet of clay, nor with our hands tied behind our backs. Why would they stand up to the Taliban or work with us, if we are only there for a one night stand? Even ten years is a one night stand in the eyes of those, who will be left behind to face the cold music of the music-less Taliban.

donegal  03/14/2012 03:36 PM Report

Dexter Filkins was excellent, as was Lara Logan. One could be happy for such great insight if the conclusions were not so abysmally sad. The US Government is largely responsible for putting and then keeping the corrupt Karzai regime in office. If we had not backed his fraudulent re-election in 2009, perhaps a new government might have been able to clean things up enough to engender the popular support that would inspire people to want to defend the government. As it is now, there is no government that most Afghans are willing to fight and die for. The saddest thing is that I can’t think of one thing we could do on our way out the door that would help the Afghan people. I hope we stop pouring in the money which will go right into suitcases for the flights to Dubai as this all falls apart. Perhaps there will be someone who comes up with a better exit plan, but certainly Zalmay Khalilzad and Seth Jones have absolutely no clue.

BENEZRAA  03/14/2012 12:56 PM Report

AF-PAK COOPERATION:

It was suggested by both Zalmay Kalilzad and Jere Van Dyk that Af-Pak cooperation is indeed a possibility. This is not trivial, nor is it trivial that US policy is moving towards an end game that will involve the Taliban, who are Pashtu, even as Karzai is Pashtu, even as north central Pakistan is Pashtu (note: while the Taliban are ethnically Pashtu, not all Pashtu are Taliban, a protracted fundamental conflict in both Pakistan and Afghanistan).

The Pashtu are geographically central to the two larger geopolitical regions of the Urdu (to the surrounding south) and the "warlord" tribes (Hazara, Tajik, Turkmen, Uzbek) to the north.

The Urdu are historically the descendants of the Moghul Empire (Jere Van Dyke spoke to the significant interest in the area to realize a Moghul restoration).

Thinking in corporate terms (where the word "corporate" refers to a body politic able to survive through time independent of particular persons), the current conflicts will inevitably yield to that corporate body or bodies capable of restoring security and order, of reining in corruption, and of establishing relative prosperity. The question is whether or not the variety of corporate bodies currently at each others' throats (e.g. Taliban, Haqqanni Network, Northern Warlords, Urdu, et al) can find sufficient common ground (even if as a result of enforced protracted stalemate due to Western intervention) to establish a viable peace.

It is essential that the West not abandon Afghanistan nor Pakistan nor India, that the West may bolster those corporate bodies to bring peace to the region.

Further, it is essential that the West, by it's active presence, exert and maintain sufficient pressure on China, such that China may hasten to leave Tibet and to leave Siankiang. Tibetan freedom is essential to the freedom of Central Asia, India, and Southeast Asia, as is the freedom of Siankiang.

Tibet is the headwater source of the famous rivers of China, Southeast Asia, India, and Pakistan. It is the spiritual value of the Tibetan People -- the profound respect for all sentient beings -- that makes an independent Tibet the best guardian of those headwaters and thus of the independence of the nations through which those great rivers flow.

The many airbases that China has established in Siankiang and by now also in Tibet pose a major threat to the stability of Central Asia and India, as does the present Chinese hegemony over the headwaters of Pakistan, India, and Southeast Asia.

It is interesting that there is great controversy presently between China and the West over the pricing and availability of rare earth metals, which China largely controls, and which China mines in Tibet.

There is a sad irony in the fact that I type these words on a computer that would likely not exist, but for the rare earth metals mined in Tibet.

ShalomFreedman  03/14/2012 06:50 AM Report

I am sorry to say that Dexter Filkins and Lara Logan were far more convincing than Seth Jones and Zalmay Khalizad. They make a strong argument for the futility and failure of the present mission in Afghanistan. They suggest that the Afghanistani government is corrupt and weak, that it has no real military force of its own, that the Taliban are waiting for the U.S. to leave before they make their major drive to take over. What they do not emphasize, and here I would point out to a brilliant piece by Vic Rosenthal on 'FresnoZionism.com' is the impossible situation American combat soldiers are put in in Afghanistan. On the one hand they must combat terrorists, and on the other they are to be a kind of Peace Corps workers whose aim is to make the local population friendly to the U.S. This is of course a part of the strange dual mission of defeating the enemy, and somehow creating for the people a new American- friendly government.

One wonders what the point of the whole enterprise is if there is not a willingness to take on the source of the Taliban strength and supply in Pakistan, and to a degree in Iran.

finalfantasytown  03/14/2012 01:59 AM Report

Lara Logan is extraordinary, and beautiful of asymmetry. When paying attention on the expression of her left face, I see pink peach. While paying attention on right face, I see a weapon, which is used by Alice in the movie of residential evil, on the back of her right shoulder. What is she talking about? Afghanistan. If making the whole face symmetry, what would it be like? I watch the eye movement covering the mouth and nose during 30-31 minutes. That is extraordinary. I look around the environment she is in. She is powerfully hitting her target. Beautiful.

coreynm  03/13/2012 08:48 PM Report

It's great to know Logan follows her gut. I remember a few years ago when her gut told her there was no way we could leave. And here we are now with many more dead and billions more down the drain.

Maybe her gut is a lot like George W's gut. I would suggest both of them moderate their gut-following by reading a history book and looking at those polls Logan so easily dismisses.

TodSpence  03/13/2012 05:40 PM Report

I have the most appreciation for the approach taken by both Lara Logan and Filkins. While I would not be quite as negative as Filkins in terms of the long term situation for Afghanistan, he is right that America cannot mold a place such as Afghanistan to its liking and we did not need the experiences of the last decade in order to come to that conclusion. Listening to what Seth Jones almost made me laugh. What he was saying was being said 6 years ago. He seems like a guy very capable of leading an on the ground operation but simply does not have the right mind for understanding and organizing long term strategy. Talking about "key areas" and where the Taliban has lost ground compared to this date and Pakistan etc. etc. DOES NOT MEAN SQUAT. Filkins responded to Seth correctly each time. The Army can shoot its way in and hold territory but so what?? So what. It simply does not matter in the case of Afghanistan. Then again in reference to Seth's PDPA reference, as if the post soviet invasion PDPA can tell us anything positive, which Seth was alluding to, in regards to a post coalition Afghanistan. The PDPA was absurdly ruthless, its known that even the KGB had to come in and tell the PDPA to pull back on the reins a little. When the KGB is saying that, its telling. With all do respect Seth just seems to be completely missing the big picture. I believe it is likely that Karzai will be able to hang on to some substantial portion of the country but it is going to be in an "Afghanistan way" which means it will be something of a nation state but not in a way that any westerner or any non-Afghan could fully comprehend. Hopefully the US will leave Afghanistan while keeping it penetrated out the Wazoo intelligence wise. The US can always go in a kill some bad guys and an armed, on the ground presence is not necessary for that.

BoseEinstein  03/13/2012 04:43 PM Report

I really liked what Lara Logan had to say!Very interesting!

cfmtrans  03/13/2012 02:08 PM Report

"I think" Lara Logan nailed the situation in Afghanistan and Pakistan. March 12, 2012 "Update on Afghanistan".

BENEZRAA  03/13/2012 01:46 PM Report

QUALIFICATION OF PRIOR COMMENT

China's occupation is not the cause of high spirituality in Tibet; China is the anti-spiritual element that poisons the region. China has lost sight of it's own spiritual heritage and may best regain it by leaving Tibet.

BENEZRAA  03/13/2012 01:42 PM Report

TIBET IS THE KEY TO AFGHANISTAN; YET, TIBET IS IGNORED, AND CHINA IS LOOKED TO ALONG WITH RUSSIA TO BE JOINT SUPERPOWER PARTICIPANTS IN ESTABLISHING ORDER IN CENTRAL ASIA.

Jere Van Dyk pointed out the importance of water resources to both Pakistan and Afghanistan. A discussion of the importance of water to Central and Southeast Asia and China would be most enlightening.

Tibet is not merely a place of high spirituality under Chinese occupation. Tibet is the primary water source for Pakistan, India, Southeast Asia, and China.

<http://peakwater.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/tibet_map_2.jpg>

Afghanistan does not depend on Tibet for it's water and is central to Central Asia.

<http://www.vendian.org/mncharity/dir3/afghan_map/UnstableURL/afghanistan_solid.gif>

<http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/static/in_depth/americas/2001/military_picture/regional_map.stm>

China must be convinced to leave Tibet. When the source of water is at peace, the region will be at peace.

REMant  03/13/2012 01:38 PM Report

We saw several such incidents in Vietnam, the majority of which were covered up. There many during WWII. There seems to be no way to prevent them. It may be that the sergeant had a physical problem, a psychological one or that this was just his way of hurrying this war to a conclusion. But whatever the case, he will have to pay for it with his life. Nothing less will do.

No matter the strategies being pursued, American and NATO participation, short of building up a force of half a million men or more, is finished. Anything else will just cost money and lives. I'm sorry that this is the case, because as in Vietnam there will be retributions, but facts is facts.

Most likely the Karzai govt is finished, too, and the country headed for war between north and south. I'm sorry that whoever is in charge at CBS doesn't realize this, but I'm sure my Stars & Stripes compatriot Steve Kroft, and, apparently Lara Logan, do. I would suggest Mr Jones and ex-ambassador Khalilzad spend a little more time studying up on the early Vietnam years, because after a decade here we seem to be only up to 1965. I would also suggest that they are hardly disinterested, Mr Khalilzad sounding like Madame Chiang.

And I think we seriously need someone to explain exactly why we are fighting the Taliban in the first place.