Charlie Rose

JohnGelles  09/12/2011 03:52 AM Report

errata:

1. are involved if you would defend our nation

2. He appears to me to be a master of detail

3. (in my memory at least) as a commanding personality

4. we have not scratched the surface of the sources

Sorry. I'm so afraid of a crash I leave errors for which there is no excuse -- not even this one.

JohnGelles  09/12/2011 03:34 AM Report

Leon Panetta was remarkably open with the American people in explaining how many issues of power, wealth, intelligence, tactics, strategy, courage, culture, history, geography, and science, etc., are involved in if you wind defend our nation and civilization itself, simultaneously.

He was an army intelligence officer, and graduated to become a chief of staff to the president on his way to becoming a numero-uno/chief of operations at intelligence and defense.

Were he to graduate to become Secretary of State, he would be the best trained person to ever hold the position. He is, it appears to me, to be a master of detail and multi-tasking. His quiet un-dramatic presence seems to point to staff and not to the role of commander-in-chief (or commanding general). I wonder what he would say about such an assessment by a layman like me.

When I was young, Harold Lasswell wrote "Power and Personalty" wherein the role of "dictator" or "tyrant" was defined (in my memory at least) as commanding personality inside a deprived sick person whose early death would be a Godsend to all concerned.

Panetta is the opposite type of public servant. He is utterly trustworthy because he has not been deprived or demented in his youth or adult life.

As to America's role in developing a sane political structure for peace and progress in which there is ample room for mega-nations like China and India and conglomerates of the same size like Europe and America, it will take a lot of Panetta's to be staff officers and chiefs of staff.

It will also require Washington's, Lincoln's and Roosevelt's to lead them if we are to establish a worldwide Second Bill of Rights and language of finance built on logistics not roulette.

As usual I find REMant to be off on the wrong track, in search of a world before nuclear weapons and infinite computational power. He shuns the general welfare in favor of freedom to have no benign purpose for the neighborhood.

Other opinion by Rose and Panetta dealt more with the micro than macro problems and solutions in my view. No doubt we live in a micro world with macro problems. And they will not call on me to tell them we have scratched the surface of the sources of America's wealth that must be mobilized to support diplomatic offensives to prevent war, intelligence offensives to prevent surprise, and military alliances to remain on the offensive against tyranny and do their damnedest to prevent proliferation of nuclear weapons and WMD's by our natural enemies.

Who is a natural enemy of the United States? We may need to find all the Panetta's we can, to keep current with a satisfactory answer. And I will be glad to help them.

BENEZRAA  09/12/2011 12:38 AM Report

NOW THAT THE "BOOGEYMAN" IS DEAD

Now that Ossama bin Laden is dead, the "raison d'etre" for our presence and war in Afghanistan is accomplished -- or is it?

It is time to ask the hard questions, put aside pretense, and ask ourselves, if we have what it takes to truly commit to the future. Whatever the costs now in lives and money, high as they would be, there is much at stake, and those costs would be immeasurably higher in the future, should we have any standing and ability in the world, when that future comes, to engage where engagement need be met. How much time may we afford to those, who mean us harm? How much delusion do we afford ourselves, that the two ponds between east and west protect us? We are no longer an island of ourselves, if ever we were.

BENEZRAA  09/12/2011 12:23 AM Report

RE: BUILDINGS ABOVE AND BELOW GROUND

Is it possible that after the attack on the Twin Towers and the Pentagon, and a possible attack on the White House nipped in the bud by courageous passengers that went down with their plane in PA, that just maybe some bunker building is in order? Today is Anniversary Ten of Nine-Eleven, and while I have no inside knowledge, I'd be inclined not to assume these buildings are deliberate wastes of government money.

doodah  09/09/2011 09:20 AM Report

... anybody with an objective conscience can only sit back and watch this Train Wreck unfold. And keep a loaded weapon close by so that when they come to sink their bloody fangs into you, you can get your moneys worth (two of them for one of you).

doodah  09/09/2011 08:19 AM Report

You fellers talking about 'Bureaucracies'.?. Just get a load of this - http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/topsecretamerica/

They're talking about buildings 4 stories high on the outside, but go down 10 stories below grade. A Bureaucrat's Dream Come True. We're not talking about one building with one Wizard of Oz, but multiple buildings with 10s of thousands Wizard of Ozs and Darth Vaders; and what do they do when they get bored? They suck the life blood out of the munchkins. This Bureaucracy is the cancer that Osama INTENDED to plant in the heart and mind of America so it can start eating itself from the inside out. Good job Republicans , that's alot to be proud of Teat Party , Go with it Democrats!

Not to mention, the unmentionable 'Budget'. What about that Teat Party?!

doodah  09/09/2011 07:42 AM Report

@ BENEZRAA 09/08/2011 09:56 PM

Point well taken; that's what it is, poetically worded, mind you. "..Aint that America, it's you and me, Aint that America, Home of the Free..."-John Cougar Melloncrap (he said it took him 5 years to write that song)

SharkswithfrikingLazers  09/09/2011 03:08 AM Report

State of U.S. National Security August 31, 2011

http://www.c-spanvideo.org/program/CommissionsR

Per John Lehman: Pentagon money is going to the bureaucracy. In 1947 the act limited the staff limited to 50 around the Secretary of Defense--lean and mean. Now there are 750,000 people around the Secretary of Defense. During the Reagan administration 660 ship Navy and 18 division Army. Today the budget is 50% higher than the Reagan years but the force is half the size and bureaucracy twice the size. This has happened in the intelligence community too. WHERE IS THE MONEY GOING?

Good-bye American treasure, terrorism has leveraged it all away.

BENEZRAA  09/08/2011 09:56 PM Report

RE: "CUTTING AND RUNNING" AND "GOVERNMENT PAYROLL"

Thanks for your more circumspect comment and tacit compliment. I do hope and pray, that you are correct, that we will not cut and run from Af/Pak. My personal memory includes the Vietnam War era, and I do remember the news footage of panicked Vietnamese dangling from our helicopters, as we cut and ran from the Nam, and I remember it, as if it were yesterday. Those, who were there, still live in that moment, when Congress just cut off the funding, leaving those, who relied on us, at the mercy of the Viet Cong and the North Vietnamese Army. Much as I opposed the Vietnam War then and still do now, the manner of our departure was a national shame and a continued tragedy to Nam. Congress then made it easy for Americans not to serve in the military by eliminating the draft, creating an all volunteer army, thus creating a military class totally separate from civilian life. No wonder there is an isolationist disposition to much of the nation, that would live in a bubble between the Atlantic and the Pacific in the same way that they would live in a bubble on the Stock Market. As for the "government payroll" -- it's too complex for me on a beautiful early fall evening of sweet jazz ballads. I will say that ultimately all payroll is government payroll in one way or another, it's just a matter of where, when, why, and how you are along the river, what you are doing there, how much of it flows to you, etc., and the fact that too much water can often be as violently destructive as too little water. I am not sure of the tone of my words at the moment, as I am quite tired after a long several days. I hope that, just as there is no malice in your words, that there is no malice in mine, nor arrogance, just, "This is what I think."

doodah  09/08/2011 01:15 PM Report

Well, since you put it that way, you may pass. But some of 'your' "facts" are stretched mixed with speculation. That's all I'm saying; No "guilt" just hawkish exaggeration (esp. the "cutting and running" comment, because that's NOT what's going to happen).

And thank you for your commentary, and continued good diet and health (unless your on the government payroll, then we got Real Issues).

BENEZRAA  09/08/2011 12:50 PM Report

DEAR MR. DOODAH:

You are welcome to your opinion, which you claim to be "objective". I make no such grandiose claim with respect to my own opinion. But I do support my opinion with fact and reasonable analysis. Few people walk on water; I know that I do not; and yet somehow there is an expectation by the public that our politicians walk on water. In my commentary below I have strongly criticized policy; but, I have not engaged in name calling nor in character assassination. You claim that I am guilty of "exaggeration". But, you do not point to a single specific "exaggeration", nor do you discuss it. Unlike some of your better writing, in the matter at hand you have offered only platitudes. You should realize that there is far more consistency of foreign policy from POTUS to POTUS and from Congress to Congress than is portrayed by each Administration, Party, and Media. It is not trivial that Leon Panetta was unanimously confirmed by the Senate. This should suggest to you and to everyone that there is far more "bipartisanism" occurring in the halls of government than tends to make it into the light of day. So the issue here is policy, not party or persons. I do hope that persons smarter and more knowledgeable than I am will take action in the best interests of the nation and of the world; I am sure that you do as well. Thank you again for your own commentary, Mr. Doodah. And enjoy your popcorn! I am a big fan of popcorn myself! It's a great source of whole grain fiber and helps to keep me regular!

doodah  09/08/2011 08:36 AM Report

... another word on the 'republican stategery' , why has 'Dick Cheney' (Darth Bin Vader) bin sticking his head out and barking at the moon these last few years?. Seems a little TOO DEFENSIVE if you ask me.

doodah  09/08/2011 08:10 AM Report

Exaggerating like that, BENEZRAA, will only 'encourage' Exaggeration from the equally wrong point of view. Hence our political system, so what gets done gets done halfway. Hence our economy and the republican strategery of the war.

Let's be objective here, Obama is handling the war much better than Bush did, who has mired us in a deep dark underground bureaucracy, that who knows what the hell their really doing. Probably eating popcorn and monitoring this website while planning their next paid vacation.

BENEZRAA  09/07/2011 10:11 PM Report

AN OPEN LETTER TO "DEMOCRATS", "REPUBLICANS", REPUBLICRATS, BUREAUCRATS, KLEPTOCRATS, AUTOCRATS, AND ALL PERNICIOUS CRATS, ARCHYS, ISMS, ETC.

Secretary Panetta's duty under the current administration is to bring to market a low-key Afghanistan exit plan that may best be characterized as "Buzz and Mush" as opposed to "Shock and Awe". Afghanistan is surrounded by Pakistan in the south, Iran in the west, multiple other "-stans" to the north (just below Russia), and China and North Korea to the east. Is it any wonder that Afghanistan is more than a little stressed out at the present time?

There is no more important time in our lives to strengthen our resolve to secure Afghanistan. No one else will do it and the Afghan People need our help. Afghanistan is torn in every direction, and the sooner we leave, the sooner Afghanistan will be torn apart. Those, who talk of scaling down our military, delude themselves into thinking that we are cozy here and that it is not our problem. And others think we are the cause of the problem and that we have no justification to be there, not now, not ever. Such persons will leave Afghans struggling for freedom to the mercy of puppets, criminals, and totalitarianism.

Such persons will also lose Pakistan and place all of Central Asia in the hands of totalitarian regimes that will then target India, Southeast Asia, and South Korea. And then Australia, New Zealand, the Pacific Islands, Japan and the Phillippines fall into risk, if they are not already at risk. (To those, who in reading these words are reliving the Vietnam War according to the argument of the Domino Theory, while the hypothesis to this argument hit the dart board, it missed the bulls-eye; for had we maintained strong relations with HoChiMinh and devoted our forces to keeping China out of Tibet and Siankiang, none of the dominoes would have fallen, whereas today we face a world in which dominoes are falling all over the place).

Shall we fail to come to the aid of Tibet and Siankiang, leaving those nations slaves to China? Shall we fail to come to the aid of Iran, where so many seek our help to break free of their present tyrannical regime? Shall we fail to maintain our influence in Iraq, which could slip into civil war overnight? Shall we ignore the four other continents, that require our attention and our leadership?

Shall we shrink our Navy, as China and Iran expand their navies? Shall we shrink our Airforce, as China, Iran, and Venezuela and Russia expand their airforces? Shall we shrink our Army and Marines, too? Shall we rely on a shrinking "volunteer" military service [which de facto is a mercenary military] and leave off responsibility that should be born by the entire nation? Shall we pretend we are unaware that the private sector militaries [true mercenary armies] are not bleeding us dry and that they may not have agendas of their own?

Secretary Panetta speaks of the "weakness" of current and recent rashes of successful assassinations by the Taliban (and the many other "jihadi" fronts for all the surrounding nations, especially Iran, Russia, and China). The number, frequency, and deep penetrations that characterize these assassinations do not at all appear to be the actions of amateur desperados; they look very much like the actions of well planned, well organized, well trained, well supported, well financed, well politicized, and well publicized players.

No matter how it is packaged, cutting and running is cutting and running. Like it or not, the USA is now faced with much more than a loss of face. The USA is faced with a loss of all true respect and credibility in the world. By failing to come to the aid of the Third World, the USA will devolve into the Third World. By failing to call Europe and Russia to task, by allowing these "allies" to shirk their responsibilities, they, too, will soon devolve to Third World status. There will be no more quibbling about the prognostications of ratings agencies, as they will no longer exist, as there will no longer be Free Market Economies nor a Free World. If we cut and run from Afghanistan, what hope is there for the success of the Arab Spring (which in the eyes of many is a remote hope to begin with, and for others a fresh breeze that may change the entire odor of the middle east as we know it).

I do not envy Secretary Panetta. I do not envy President Obama. I do not envy the tough decisions they must make, nor the daily factionalisms they must face, be those factionalisms national or international. At best they are herding cats, the cats that we elected. We must hope and pray that our leadership is a nation of lions and not pussycats, that our leadership is healthy and vigorous, that our leadership hunts keenly and not rapidly, that our leadership does what needs to be done and not less, that our leadership does what needs to be done and does not wantonly nor randomly ruin and pillage, that our leadership does Our Constitution honor for our sake and for the world's sake. Amen.

SharkswithfrikingLazers  09/07/2011 09:59 PM Report

Charlie, a question you might have asked is why we cut $800 million in military aid to Pakistan and what we expect to gain by it.

Leon Panetta said bin Laden was trapped on the third floor and there was no trap door, no secret passage, no "hidey-hole" so he must have felt very safe. Hey, he even surrounded himself with family.

So was $800 million enough? Remember what a bad boy Pakistan is and if there is another Mumbai out of their country we may be looking at nuclear explosions.

SharkswithfrikingLazers  09/07/2011 05:21 PM Report

Leon Panetta nailed it. It is a combination of diplomacy and defense.

However, both need to evolve. Defense is evolving slowly with more Seal Team Six raids and heavy use of drones (so how many aircraft carriers do we really need?). Diplomacy needs to evolve with "raids" of bread and drones targeting areas to drop bread (or Plumpy'nut, or MREs) to our Arab brothers fighting for freedom.

We have the guns part down really, really well. Let's evolve the butter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guns_versus_butter_model

SharkswithfrikingLazers  09/07/2011 04:07 PM Report

Charlie you look marvelous.

It must be your recess and that pink tie again.

Something about the reflection of all those studio lights on your pink tie makes you look like the image of health and beauty.

By the way, they use pink lighting in funeral homes for viewings. That normally doesn't work at all. Perhaps they need to experiment with pink cloth. (Another million dollar idea offered up for free.)

doodah  09/07/2011 01:12 PM Report

I've grown to respect Leon-the-Neon Panhandler. During the Clinton administration I hated him. But, by coincidence, I find I am walking a similar path, a former republican, he a democrat, me, maybe an apolitical revolutionary conservative .

doodah  09/07/2011 12:44 PM Report

REMant, if that indeed happened under a Barrack Obama's watch, then that just goes to show it's the Bureaucrats that really run the show. Last night's 'Frontline' episode was a real eye opener (if what they say is true.?) (I'm not quite sure it is, it's more of former disgruntled employee's point of view). But it did raise my eyebrows when Pres. Bush decided to Grow the Bureaucracy to fight terrorism, as it did when he chose to focus attention on Saddam Hussein, I did not understand the logic. It's looking more and more my instincts were correct. The republicans strategy was too far reaching (assuming Frontline is reporting the truth).

Now, on to the interview.

REMant  09/07/2011 11:06 AM Report

Good move to avoid Libya, Perry, political polls, economics, hurricanes, earthquakes and everything else that's happened the past two weeks. I thought Panetta was a reasonable choice for the times, but I am troubled by the idea that we continue to gear up for imperialist-style police actions, as much as mercantilist economic policies, similar to what brought down Liberalism prior to WWI. The 19th c Liberals were noted not only for election reform and the support of freedom, but also free trade and pacifism. This is the province of libertarianism today, which I hope is in the ascendant after a century of repudiation in favor of welfare capitalism and militarism. The same forces, incidentally, destroyed pre-war socialism. This is the real issue of the upcoming election and it ought to concern Democrats no less than Republicans.

And it should be noted that Britain was long past its prime when it embarked on this path. Soft power, it could be said, is all you have left when you've run out of hard power, but it would seem to be a greater danger. Weakness begets conflict, not strength. In the past few years we've seen govt agencies ignore laws passed to curtail Vietnam-era abuses. Just a week of so ago DC police felt obliged to jail for several days on bread and water in 90 degree heat environmentalists protesting outside the White House. Too, the statement that when a leader begins shooting his own people, not only betrays an ignorance of historical politics, but also suggests that this is somehow worse than a central bank robbing millions of the product of their labor. BTW, the "Arab spring" seems to have sprung in Israel, too.