Charlie Rose

rojelio  08/20/2010 12:20 AM Report

At least he's talking about renewable energy. I wish he'd demonstrate more convincingly that he understands peak oil and all of the implications that this has. Crappy answer in responding to why they gave all the bailout money to his banking buddies rather than helping the middle class. Charlie Rose is a great talk show, but I wish he'd hold these guys feet to the fire a bit more on this stuff. Like why are we wasting trillions of dollars in Afghanistan? We're in bad shape man.

robdverity  06/09/2010 05:19 PM Report

Obama's just announced $400 million to Abbas will make him very foolish if its delivery is also filtered, screened and pilfered by the Israelis. And you know it will be. And the amount is so minimal (compared to Israel) it's insulting.

Obama is falling all over himself to be foolish and disappointing.

robdverity  06/08/2010 06:05 PM Report

Well thanks Zack. Your educated approach is admittedly much more effective. And thanks for the Sara Roy contribution. Wasn't aware. And I personally appreciate the exclusion of calls to prayer. History shows prayer magnifies evil - mostly because it's senseless, unanswered and falsely provides hope when there (usually) is none. Real hope is already extant from facts on the ground - or it isn't. Prayer dissembles and stagnates.

Indeed, your suspicions are spot-on, I'm obsessed re prayer and religion. I rest my case on some of the most prominent world prayers and their sites that are side-by-each: The Western Wailing Wall, and the Dome of the Rock Mosque. The lynch-pin for the so-called end-of-days. Exacerbated by mindless Christians and their equally fatuous prayers.

The rub? The more each prays the more radicalized each become and the closer WE ALL come to the self-fulfilling Armageddon.

A nice impartial meteor, or volcano would be so much what(?), kinder I guess. Unless meteors can hate (and pray?) as well.

Zack  06/08/2010 08:02 AM Report

@ Robdevrity: Please you can make your point without being vulgar. I certainly join prayers for peace but this is does not mean I am not for concrete actions starting with the USA to stop our blind relationship with Israel. As Meir Dagan Chief of Mossad said Israel is becoming a burden for the USA and from my point of view has been for decades. Our tax payer money equivalent of more than 100 billions of dollars has been given to Israel, Why? For this country to be our watchdog in our relationship with oil rich countries in the arab world? The truth of the situation in the occupied territories is never shown in our mainstream media filled of propaganda. It is time to reconsider our relationship with Israel and stop allocating billions we deseperately need to support our own economy and folks in the US.

@ Benezraa: I have heard before your historical perspective on this land which could be disputed but I am not going to do it here simply because this is a disgression. (and between if the jews were there first and have right to claim the land then maybe we should give back our land to the Native Indians...funny logic...and this space we might have a family of dinosaurs coming to claim the whole planet!). Anyway my point is that the occupation of the palestinian territories is wrong, Israel is acting like an arrogant bully and always play the victim when it is in reality the "bourreau".

If you have lived through war then you should know better about the brutality of the "Operation Cast Lead" and you should be condemning what Israel is doing to this population.

If you believe that the blockade is to forbid Hamas to get weapons then either you don't know much about the topic or you are extremely cynical. Sara Roy professor at Harvar University wrote "How can keeping food and medicine from the people of Gaza protect the people of Israel? How can the impoverishment and suffering of Gaza’s children – more than 50 per cent of the population – benefit anyone? International law as well as human decency demands their protection".

This blockade is an insult to human dignity and just been used as a collective punishment from the Israelis (with the blessing of the US government) in hope that the population will turn against Hamas. Mission failed miserably.

In all seriousness Benezraa how can you justify that and again I quote Sara Roy:

"Israel now allows only 30 to 40 commercial items to enter Gaza compared to 4,000 approved products prior to June 2006. According to the Israeli journalist, Amira Hass, Gazans still are denied many commodities (a policy in effect long before the December assault): Building materials (including wood for windows and doors), electrical appliances (such as refrigerators and washing machines), spare parts for cars and machines, fabrics, threads, needles, candles, matches, mattresses, sheets, blankets, cutlery, crockery, cups, glasses, musical instruments, books, tea, coffee, sausages, semolina, chocolate, sesame seeds, nuts, milk products in large packages, most baking products, light bulbs, crayons, clothing, and shoes."

Please read full article by copy/paste the link below:

http://cmes.hmdc.harvard.edu/node/1594

Ben you are a Jew and you consider Israel to be a safe haven if all countries including us the USA turn their back to Jews. I don't personally understand this level of victimization and trauma. The black population has suffered a lot as well and we do not see the same victim syndrom we see in you.

As well bare in mind that without the USA, Israel would have to finally deal with the occupation by answering to the International community. Only thanks to our US veto Israel has been able to get away with everything. Time that our tax money stays at home and time for the Americans to wake up because our country is in an unimaginable mess. We don't need to carry the mess of Israel with us as well.

robdverity  06/07/2010 10:24 PM Report

Ben - you wily fox, you intentionally miss the point to dodge the analogy you know is there, namely Israeli bulldozer a la Israeli Tienanmen Square tank driver. To head-off further disingenuous evasion, I'll get graphic: there would be pulverized cartilage, bone, viscera, blood and rectum reduced to a smudge in the tarmac. Not the humanitarian tank turning and acquiescence by the (non-Israeli) driver. GET IT?? Israeli's never pass up a chance to murder - ONLY four today (five short of previous mayhem). You're a bloodthirsty lot. The kill ratio used to be 100:1. Has to be higher now.

You consume paragraphs ascribing your (Israeli's) woes on damn near everyone except yourselves (France, England, USA, yadda, yadda). I know nothing of the history but never hear a query of, What have we done? Why the relentless persecution? A great rationalizer such as yourself surely has pondered this. Expulsions (Egypt?), pogroms (E. Europe, Russia), Holocaust, Diasporas . . . . ultimately to Armageddon. Seems systemic. Beginning in Egypt? Does that make Egypt an original start point? Jewry is one complicated tableau. As you can tell I don't comprehend its whys and wherefores, and especially its history.

But are you as blameless as you like to pose? I think your 5th, 4th and 3rd paragraphs from the bottom says not no, but hell no. You and Zack better shift into overtime on that prayer BS, cause your real-life attitude says the shit hitting the fan is fully assured. You are exposed for the jingo you really are. Shalom (he said laughingly).

BENEZRAA  06/07/2010 07:56 PM Report

ROBDVERITY - YOUR ALLEGED CONUNDRUM IS RIDICULOUS TO CONSIDER, AS RIDICULOUS AS ASKING YOU TO CONSIDER WHAT WOULD HAPPEN, IF HAMAS WERE TO TAKE OVER THE TOWN IN WHICH YOU LIVE.

You and I are both safe and secure in the USA, thanks to our Armed Forces and thanks to the CIA and FBI. The difference is that I am do not blame the problems of the world on Israel or the USA. I regard both of these countries as lights unto the world.

BENEZRAA  06/07/2010 07:52 PM Report

ZACK, THANK YOU FOR SHARING IN MY PRAYERS FOR THE SAFETY OF THE VESSEL "RACHEL CORRIE" AND FOR THE SECURE DELIVERY OF HUMANITARIAN GOODS INTO GAZA. WE SHOULD PRAY AS WELL THAT THOSE GOODS ARE NOT TRADED THROUGH THE MANY SMUGGLER TUNNELS OR NOW ACROSS THE OPEN BORDER INTO EGYPT IN EXCHANGE FOR MORE ROCKETS AND OTHER WEAPONS FOR HAMAS TO WAGE ANOTHER INTIFADA AGAINST ISRAEL.

When I read the "Mother Jones" article about the death of Rachel Corrie, the article made clear that there were homes being demolished by Israeli law pertaining to the defense of Israel. I do support Israel's right to self defense in this way. "Mother Jones" properly reported on the story without choosing sides for which I commend "Mother Jones".

I appreciate your softer tone. I hope it will continue. I must bring a few corrections to your attention for clarification, as pertain to statements I have made and to opinions I hold.

Be aware that it is important to quote correctly. I referred to the home of a "Palestinian Arab". I did not refer to the home of a "Palestinian". There is a vital and important reason for this. If you are a Jew, as I am a Jew, then you must know that by definition you and I and all Jews are "Palestinians", as the name "Palestine" (more accurately, "Palestina") is the name that Roman conquerors gave to Israel as an humiliation two-thousand years ago. The Romans occupied Israel, killed off most Jews resisting Roman occupation; then most remaining Jews went into exile around the world, alternately celebrated and persecuted. "Palestine" is by definition ISRAEL.

That the British, who occupied Israel in the early 20th Century, chose to call our homeland "Palestine" instead of Israel, is merely another humiliation to Jews. Then of course the British reneged on the Balfour Declaration, which would have clearly created Israel and Jordan as Palestinian Jewish and Palestinian Arab States. After all, in the many years of Jewish exile from the Holy Land, even though the majority population has been Palestinian Arab, there has always been a Jewish presence, and there has always been worldwide Jewish prayer to return to the Holy Land and rebuild it.

Instead we have had a century of bloodshed, thanks to the British and French and the USA, and to the Nazis and the Mufti of Jerusalem. The Mufti of Jerusalem allied with Hitler. If the French and the British, with American permission, had not raped the Germans via the Versailles Treaty after WW-1, then Germany would not have been so radicalized and Hitler would never have come to power. There would have been no circumstance under which the Jerusalem Mufti would have had a fascist Germany with which to ally. Similarly, there would have been six-million European Jews thriving and bringing Jewish life into the world in an entirely different Europe. I condemn American President Woodrow Wilson, Princeton University intellectual and idealist, for having enabled the British and French to take harsh and unusual advantage of the Germans, laying the underpinnings of WW-2.

The Zionist Movement, which started in the late 1800's, would have succeeded in a very different manner than WW-2's annihilation of European Jewry made necessary. There would still be major Jewish populations in most Arab countries, and Arab-Jewish relations would be very different. There would be no Hamas, no Hezbollah, no Al-Aqsa Brigades, no PLO.

All this said, history is what it is, not what we want it to be. And, history being what it is, I am a Jew, and if and when the USA turns against me in the way that all other nations have turned against Jews throughout history, then I have no place to go except Israel. For other Jews in the world this is not a future speculation. It is something that happened to their families already, or it is something that threatens their families now.

The Palestinian Arabs of Israel -- many if not most of whom may biologically be as Jewish as I am, as many Jews in history were absorbed into the world of Islam and now speak Arabic instead of Hebrew and pray as Muslims and not as Jews -- at least have common faith and language with 300 million Arabs in more than twenty nations surrounding Israel. Is it too much to ask, that these surrounding Arab nations acknowledge that they have not sufficiently protected the "Peoples of the Book" (Jews and Christians) and to therefore immediately acknowledge that Israel, which allows and protects peoples of all faiths (including Muslims) indeed has a right to exist -- not just legally, but, ethically, morally, and religiously? Is it too much to ask that they acknowledge that they have asked too much sacrifice of the Palestinian Arabs -- unending martyrdom -- and instead invite and welcome these Palestinian Arabs into their nations and give them honor and security and a special status? Is is too much to ask, that when all of these Arab countries have waged war after war against Israel, that they not expect return of territory that they lost in war, seeking to annihilate Israel? Have they no honor? They lost! Instead they are still in a technical state of war with Israel, which they wage by proxy via the Palestinian Arabs.

In my opinion Israel should not wait for it's enemies to behave morally. Israel should exercise it's own moral obligation to itself by reaffirming it's former annexations of Jerusalem and Golan and by additionally annexing Judea-Samarea (the world calls this territory the 'West Bank') and Sheva Farms. As well, in light of Egypt's decision to indefinitely open up it's borders with Gaza,

Israel must anticipate that Hamas will successfully bring in more missiles, more arms, and steel and concrete for bunker building; Israel must determine a strategy to act accordingly, perhaps by reoccupying Gaza.

Zack, I admire your idealism. But, "I" have lived too long through too many wars, and "I" have been lied to too many times by too many insincere nations, if I may use the first person singular to refer to Israel as "I". "I" am sick of exile and occupation. "I" am in my own homeland now, where "I" speak Hebrew and worship as a Jew.

This is my opinion. Others may think and feel differently. I acknowledge that they do. They may be right or wrong, just as I may be right or wrong. My the Lord inspire Peace. By the way the Rachel Corrie docked safely in Israel and the humanitarian goods will find their way legally into Gaza. However, today is Day 1472 in the kidnapping and captivity of Gilad Shalit by Hamas.

robdverity  06/07/2010 03:40 PM Report

Zack - you conclusion jump. The capitalized "NOTHING A JEW CAN DO OR SAY THAT IS GOOD OR HUMANE.," was a quote from Benezraa. Nonetheless, I do indeed condemn killing and particularly gratuitous killing that the Israelis repeatedly excel in. [Just today they shot and killed four divers - like fish in a barrel. Ole Ben doubtless has a rationalization at the ready. Just ask him.]

I also detest obsequious, unctuous sliminess of faux (or real) religious hypocritical piety. Your skin crawling unctions are counter-productive. Religions got us to this point. They and there associated artifice of prayer will only defer REAL solutions. Prayer cannot substitute for action - as it seems to do to date. Five-a-days seem about as effective as four-a-days; or weekly, or occasions(ally). They're all fatuous, insulting time-wasters that perniciously fool and delude (a la the two of you) that one (anyone) is actually doing something. BS! CHILDISH!!!!

One last zinger to consider. My disdain for killing puts the CIA above the Israelis (or is that below?) for sinking humans and humanity further into degradation by their use of unmanned drone-firing missiles. Soldiers in a fire-fight (mano-o-mano) is senseless enough. Premeditated murder from a base in Nevada or equally remote sites is a techno-arrogance that will come home to roost (Wall St; Statue of Liberty?). It's cowardice, stupid and counter-productive. The civilian kills (so-called collaterals) aggregates a net gain in enmity and enemies with each use. AND CHILDISH! THEY HAVE KILLED THREE NO.2 AL QAEDAS IN THE LAST SIX MONTHS (BS PROPOGANDA DOUBTLESS TO JUSTIFY THEIR USE).

So if you and Ben insist on praying for something, start at home. Pray that we will not kill merely because we can. But like all prayers it's for naught. Obama is considering the capability to deliver a nuke? bomb? anywhere within an hour. Holy shit what a mentality. Doomsday is jeering us with each passing minute; and the good ole USA is leading the way. Prayer? Well yeah of course, provided we don't kill each other over which direction we're facing.

Quandary for Ben: what would the Tiananmen Square episode been like with an Israeli at the controls of the tank?

Zack  06/07/2010 06:54 AM Report

@ Benezraa: One more thing If your source to have a good understanding on the case of Rachel Corrie is the motherjones website then It is laughable. If you want to have a better understanding then watch the thorough investigation made by Simone Bitton in her documentary Rachel:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_BZZg7jZBs

Zack  06/07/2010 06:45 AM Report

@ Robdverity: Your comments are appaling. Condemning Israeli policies is one thing but attacking the whole jewish community is another and a highly dangerous one. Bare in mind that many in Israel are fierce critics or the policies of their government and would like to find a peaceful solution and an end to the occupation. By bringing some hate to the debate is unproductive to say the least and I condemn it.

@ Benezraa: It is interesting that you have said now that you have changed the term home of a terrorist to a home of Palestinians. Glad you have changed your stand.

Now re Rachel Corrie I doubt we can qualify her as a martyr FYI a martyr knows he or she is going to die for a cause (driven by some religious beliefs). Rachel was fighting for life and I doubt she wanted to die, she decided to devote her young life to make a difference in this World and for the right of the Palestinians to live in dignity and in Peace.

Of course I join you in your prayer that the vessel to Gaza will pass safely...even more I pray for an end of the Occupation of the Palestinian territories by Israel, an end to the ugliness of checkpoints, blockade and this ugly wall of separation. I pray for a just peace between the two people, I pray for dialogue and understanding instead of hate and cheap labelling.

I hope you will join me in these prayers as well!

robdverity  06/07/2010 02:07 AM Report

NOTHING A JEW CAN DO OR SAY THAT IS GOOD OR HUMANE. Shall I deny the kill ratio, the history, the inhumane oppression?

When an Israeli does something humane relative to the conflict, you prob. wont need to crow about it as it will be extraordinarily newsworthy. To whit: "Humane Israeli bulldozer driver turns to avoid woman's head and crushes her legs instead." Israeli's are touting his herculean effort. "Further accolades were made for the rappelling heroes that killed ONLY nine civilians."

You don't seem to have a clue re how fatuous your constant stream of rationalizations come off. You can say you believe the bulldozer driver didn't see her if you want, but the whole encounter by definition required each was aware of the other to make it that - an encounter, a demonstration. An encounter is not an encounter or a demonstration otherwise. You validate this by referring to her as a martyr - which requires awareness by both parties. Calling it an accident demeans her, the act and everything she stood for. And you as well.

Accepting every heinous Israeli act with your ceaseless rationalizations and charging me with a lack of reason makes you equally obtuse. Israeli's bulldoze woman. Ben: well it was an accident. Israeli's kill (murder) nine civilians. Ben: well they provoked us (in high seas). Israeli's been crapping on Pals for over 50 yrs. Ben: it's OK. They deserve it and more.

Your ceaseless defense of the indefensible is beyond the pale. And yes, right back at you, beyond reason. If mine is characterized as a mudslide, yours is a bloodslide - and ongoing.

BENEZRAA  06/07/2010 12:40 AM Report

DEAR MR. ROBDVERITY, ANYONE WHO READS YOUR COMMENTS CAN SEE CLEARLY THAT YOU ARE DRIVEN BY A PASSIONATE HATRED OF ALL THINGS JEWISH. IN YOUR MIND THERE IS NOTHING A JEW CAN DO OR SAY THAT IS GOOD OR HUMANE. WE HAD A PRIOR CONVERSATION NOT TOO LONG AGO IN WHICH I THOUGHT WE HAD FOUND SOME COMMON GROUND. HOWEVER YOUR MUDSLIDE OF COMMENTS SINCE THEN HAVE DISPELLED THAT ILLUSION. EXPECTING REASON FROM YOU IS LIKE EXPECTING PEACE FROM HAMAS - POINTLESS.

Robdverity, you are devoted to defining everything in terms of the worst lies and stereotypes about Jews throughout history. You smear this dogma everywhere. You accuse the bulldozer driver of the deliberate murder of Rachel Corrie and accuse the driver of doing so from the perspective of misplaced idealism. It is much more likely that the driver could not see her nor hear her. Be that as it may, there is logic [as opposed to proof] to your argument. So, as an exercise in logic: even if the driver did run her over deliberately [unproven], and, even if he did so out of misplaced idealism [conjecture and opinion, which is your right], none of that changes my right to believe that Rachel Corrie gave succor to Hamas of her own misplaced idealism. When you can tell me that Hamas has changed it's Charter to one of acceptance of Israel's existence and it's right to exist, Hamas may no longer be the absolute threat to Israel that it is today. However, as your object is to spread lies and hate, rather than to seek common ground and peace, it is no surprise that you do not accept that I sincerely wish for the safety of the ship "Rachel Corrie" and for a positive legacy in memory of the humanitarian efforts of Rachel Corrie. Your perspective is ugly and clear; ergo, clearly ugly.

robdverity  06/06/2010 11:04 PM Report

Hypocrisy-T-corn-pone! Can everyone join me in wanting to puke. The misplaced idealism was that even the most brutalized animal would not intentionally drive a bulldozer over a woman or even an innocent animal; or that a modern over-equipped army would not fire phosphorous rockets into a school building.

The putrefaction compounds with each new comment. Praying for safe passage of the eponymous ship is self serving (for Israel PR) not for any humanitarian aspects.

Israel has been limiting basic human-needs for eons. Now all-at-once (when bad PR is possible), slimy hypocrisy comes to the fore in the form of a call-to-prayer. PUKE!!

Puts Mr Esraa in perspective.

BENEZRAA  06/06/2010 09:14 PM Report

ZACK: RESPECTFULLY, I HAVE SAID NOTHING TO INSULT RACHEL CORRIE OR HER MEMORY. I HAVE SHOWN GREAT RESPECT FOR HER AND I HAVE HONORED HER MEMORY.

IT IS NOT MY OPINION THAT SHE PLACED HERSELF BETWEEN A BULLDOZER AND THE HOME OF A PALESTINIAN ARAB; IT IS A MATTER OF FACT, AND THE ACT BY WHICH SHE MARTYRED HERSELF, HOWEVER TRAGICALLY AND HOWEVER UNINTENTIONALLY.

THAT IT IS MY OPINION THAT HER IDEALISM WAS MISPLACED, AND THAT I VIEW THAT AS AN ESPECIAL ASPECT OF HER MARTYRDOM, AND THAT I DO NOT SHARE HER VIEWS DOES NOT MEAN THAT I INSULT HER, NOR DOES IT MEAN THAT I CANNOT MOURN HER LOSS.

THE BEST REPORTING ON THE TRAGIC LOSS OF THE LIFE OF RACHEL CORRIE MAY FOUND AT "MOTHER EARTH NEWS". HERE IS THE INTERNET LINK:

http://motherjones.com/politics/2003/09/death-rachel-corrie.

CAN YOU JOIN WITH ME IN PRAYING FOR THE SAFE PASSAGE OF THE VESSEL "RACHEL CORRIE", WHICH SHIP WAS NAMED IN HER HONOR?

CAN YOU JOIN WITH ME IN PRAYING FOR THE SPEEDY DISTRIBUTION INTO GAZA OF THE HUMANITARIAN AID THAT IS CARRIED ABOARD THE "RACHEL CORRIE"?

CAN YOU JOIN WITH ME IN ACKNOWLEDGING THAT DOING BOTH GIVES HONOR TO HER NAME AND TO HER HUMANITARIAN LEGACY?

robdverity  06/06/2010 02:25 PM Report

Zack - hear, hear. Well said. If Israel were a REAL friend and ally they would, like penitent lover, concede that our relationship is detrimental to each other, to world stability and world peace, and severe it starting with refusal of all financial and military aid. They are prob. economically better off than we are anyway. Perhaps they could consider repayment.

Ole Ben is one helluva party-line rationalizer. He's on a Israeli Kool-aid high. They could crap in his Post Toasties and he would brag about the aroma, while consuming it with relish.

Zack  06/06/2010 01:09 PM Report

@ BENEZRAA: YES YOU HAVE BEEN INSULTING THE MEMORY OF THIS YOU WOMAN BY STATING THAT SHE HAD MISPLACED IDEALS, PUT HERSELF BETWEEN A BULLDOZER AND A HOUSE OF A TERRORIST (WHEN IT IS THE HOUSE OF A HUMBLE AND SIMPLE FAMILY), ETC.

IT IS INCREDIBLE HOW YOU FEEL YOUR ARGUMENTS WITH SO MUCH PROPAGANDA. YOU ARE SURELY GETTING YOUR SIDE OF THE STORY FROM FOX NEWS!

NOW FOR PEOPLE SERIOUSLY INTERESTED IN KNOWING MORE ABOUT RACHEL CORRIE PLEASE WATCH A DOCUMENTARY MADE BY SIMONE BITTON A FRENCH-ISRAELI FILM MAKER. IT IS CALLED RACHEL:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Zyn3aSRunM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=guI8Erpe4JY&feature=fvst

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqGOikJlDn4&feature=fvst

AS AMERICAN WE SHOULD TREAT ISRAEL AS ANY OTHER COUNTRY. MOREOVER AS MEIR DAGAN HEAD OF MOSSAD SAID THAT ISRAEL IS TURNING FROM AN ASSET TO A BURDEN FOR THE USA.

WHY DID OBAMA ADMINISTRATION ALLOCATED 30 BILLIONS OF AIDS TO ISRAEL WHEN SO MANY OF OUR FOLKS ARE LOSING JOBS, HOUSES AND CANNOT FEED OR GIVE A GOOD EDUCATION TO THEIR CHILDREN?

IT IS TIME FOR ISRAEL TO RESPECT THE HUMAN DIGNITY OF PALESTINIANS OR OTHER (AS IN THE CASE OF RACHEL) AND COMPLY TO INTERNATIONAL LAWS. WE AS AMERICANS SHOULD PUT PRESSURE TO STOP THIS SO CALLED BLIND SPECIAL RELATIONSHIP WITH ISRAEL. I REFUSE THAT OUR TAX PAYER MONEY GOES TO SUPPORT AN OCCUPATION BY ISRAEL.

BENEZRAA  06/06/2010 03:05 AM Report

ZACK, RESPECTFULLY, I COMPLIMENTED RACHEL CORRIE QUITE STRONGLY, AND YOU FAIL TO RECOGNIZE THAT I DID SO. THE INSULT IS YOURS, NOT MINE, AS I DID NOT INSULT HER, AND YOU INSULT THE BOTH OF US.

Rachel Corrie in her idealism did not recognize that her activities gave succor to terrorists, whose ideals and objectives are antithetical to American ideals. That she did so is not unusual and it is the strength of America that every day American soldiers put their lives on the line to give Americans of all types the freedom to do and think freely. Rachel Corrie voluntarily chose to go to Gaza and support the Intifada. American ideals do not support the Intifada, which has as it's objective the annihilation of Israel and which does not exclude making war on the USA. For example in 2003 only a few months after Rachel Corrie gave her life in Gaza, three members of a US Diplomatic Convoy were killed by a roadside bomb in Gaza; the mission of the Convoy was to interview Palestinian Arab candidates for Fulbright Scholarships. Did the murder of those three Americans honor Rachel Corrie? Of course not. Will safe harbor of the "Rachel Corrie" and the delivery of her humanitarian aid into Gaza honor Rachel Corrie's memory? Of course it will. I have only shown honor and respect for Rachel Corrie. Unless history shows that her activities were not limited to non-violent, humanitarian-motivated activities, then I shall continue to honor her. If only her story were to inspire non-violence among those she supported!

mrkinpdx  06/05/2010 11:55 PM Report

I was embarrassed for Charlie for how he conducted this interview. He did not ask one tough question or never challenged any of the vice president's assertions. There are many well informed health care economists who think ObamaCare will lead to more health care inflation not less. It would have been interesting to see the Vice President address those real concerns. I watch this show because when done right, Mr. Rose's interviews are illuminating. Its a shame Mr. Rose missed an opportunity here to challenge many of the assertions made by the Obama Admin.

robdverity  06/05/2010 03:20 PM Report

Zack - Love your romanticism. Shamefullness and Zionism is like Gulf water and oil. Side-by-side. But shame itself, seems to convert to (a guilt?) over rationalization. Too much credit to assign guilt - suggests humanity. But keep trying.

Zack  06/05/2010 07:04 AM Report

BENEZRAA YOU SAID ON RACHEL CORRIE AND I QUOTE THAT "A FEW YEARS AGO A YOUNG AMERICAN WOMAN WITH MISPLACED IDEALS, WHICH IDEALS WERE KNOWINGLY OR UNWITTINGLY EXERCISED IN SUPPORT OF HAMAS, PLACED HERSELF BETWEEN A MOVING ISRAELI BULLDOZER AND THE HOME OF A TERRORIST, WHOSE HOME THE BULLDOZER WAS THERE BY LAW TO DEMOLISH. RACHEL CORRIE GAVE AWAY HER YOUNG LIFE BEFORE THAT BULLDOZER, A GREAT PERSONAL TRAGEDY MOURNED BY THE ENTIRE WORLD."

YOUR COMMENT IS AN INSULT TO THE MEMORY OF THIS YOUNG WOMAN WHOSE VALUES ARE NOT MISPLACED BUT ARE IN LINE WITH OUR AMERICAN VALUES AND IDEALS.

FOR ALL OF YOU TO SEE RACHEL CORRIE IN HER OWN WORDS PLEASE LOOK AT THIS VIDEO AND THINK FOR YOURSELF:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3JI-axaRF4

MOREOVER SHE TRIED TO STOP A BULLDOZER GOING TO DEMOLISH THE HOUSE OF A PALESTINIAN SHE GREW TO KNOW AND LOVE. BUT I GUESS YOU SEE ALL PALESTINIANS AS TERRORISTS! SHAME ON YOU.

MAY RACHEL REST IN PEACE.

robdverity  06/04/2010 11:28 PM Report

WWIII? Such grandiosity. A Jew that denies he walks on water, has no restraint. No such luck - for now. Let's hope doomsday comes over something more substantive - like Iran getting and demonstrating nukes fired 1000s of miles.

Wonder which bellicose belligerent will preempt the other - followed by criss-crossing of every other nuke in the final immolation. But anything for Zionism.

robdverity  06/04/2010 11:08 PM Report

Pathetically pitiful, or pitifully pathetic premeditated rationalizations for even more ham-fisted Israeli inhumanity and doubtless more murder. Shell their schools with phosphorous bombs then deny them cement.

You don't have to be a murderous baby burning bulldozer of women to be an Israeli or its supporters, but the evidence all says it doesn't hurt. Sieg Heil!

EyesOnYou  06/04/2010 10:33 PM Report

With a straight face Joe Biden tells us "South Korea" lead the investigation into the attack on the submarine. Yeah Joe, South Korea was the victim NOT the aggressor. With clueless people at the helm, no wonder we are in such trouble. The pandering to ill-gotten zionist dollars is enough to make our stomachs turn.

BENEZRAA  06/04/2010 08:32 PM Report

IS THE "RACHEL CORRIE" A PLANNED MARTYR SHIP? ONE STEP AWAY FROM WORLD WAR THREE!

A FEW YEARS AGO A YOUNG AMERICAN WOMAN WITH MISPLACED IDEALS, WHICH IDEALS WERE KNOWINGLY OR UNWITTINGLY EXERCISED IN SUPPORT OF HAMAS, PLACED HERSELF BETWEEN A MOVING ISRAELI BULLDOZER AND THE HOME OF A TERRORIST, WHOSE HOME THE BULLDOZER WAS THERE BY LAW TO DEMOLISH. RACHEL CORRIE GAVE AWAY HER YOUNG LIFE BEFORE THAT BULLDOZER, A GREAT PERSONAL TRAGEDY MOURNED BY THE ENTIRE WORLD. TODAY AN OSTENSIBLY HUMANITARIAN SHIP NAMED IN HER HONOR IS MAKING IT'S WAY TOWARDS GAZA, DOING SO JUST,BUT, NOT JUSTLY ON THE HEELS OF THE "AVI MAMARA" INCIDENT. THE OPERATORS OF THE VESSEL "RACHEL CORRIE" HAVE PUBLICLY STATED THAT THEY WILL NOT RESIST BOARDING BY THE ISRAELI NAVY AND WILL WILLINGLY BE REDIRECTED TO ASHDOD, ISRAEL.

LET US PRAY THAT THE "RACHEL CORRIE" REACHES SAFE HARBOR IN ISRAEL, AND THAT NO "INCIDENT" OCCURS THAT MAY BE BEYOND THE IMAGINATION OF THE WELL INTENDED, BUT, MISGUIDED HUMANITARIANS ONBOARD THE "RACHEL CORRIE".

SUCCESSFUL AND SAFE ARRIVAL OF THE "RACHEL CORRIE" TO ASHDOD, AND THEN THE TRANSFER OF HUMANITARIAN GOODS BY THE ISRAELIS INTO GAZA ON THE BEHALF OF THE HUMANITARIANS OF THE SHIP (LESS THE BUNKER BUILDING CONCRETE), WILL DO MUCH TO HONOR THE MEMORY OF RACHEL CORRIE AND WILL MITIGATE MUCH OF THE ANGER, ANGUISH, AND BLOTTED HUMANITARIANISM OF THE SAD INCIDENT IN WHICH RACHEL CORRIE GAVE HER LIFE. SO TOO, SAFE HARBOR WILL DO THE SAME WITH RESPECT TO THE SIMILAR RESULTS WE HAVE JUST SEEN AS INITIAL CONSEQUENCES OF THE "AVI MAMARA" INCIDENT.

MISGUIDED IN THEIR SUPPORT OF HAMAS, CONSCIOUSLY OR INADVERTENTLY, THE HUMANITARIANS OF THE "RACHEL CORRIE" MISSION MAY FACE MORE RISK THAN THEY MAY IMAGINE. SUPPOSE SOME JIHADIST TERRORISTS HAVE HIDDEN A BOMB ABOARD SHIP AND SET IT TO EXPLODE IN INTERNATIONAL WATERS, IN ISRAELI WATERS, OR EVEN IN THE PORT OF ASHDOD; SUPPOSE THERE IS A SECRET OPERATION ABOARD SHIP INVOLVING JIHADIST MARTYR BOMBERS (BE THEY HAMAS, HEZBOLLAH, I.R.A., AL-QUAEDA, SOLIDARITY, ROTE ARMEE FAKTION, OR WHOMEVER), OR ANY SIMILAR SUCH SECRET OPERATION FROM OFF SHIP (SUCH AS JIHADIST OPERATIVES DISGUISED AS ISRAELI NAVY MEN), OR ANY TYPE OF SUCH SINISTER EVENT DESIGNED TO CAST BLAME ON ISRAEL AND TO ENFLAME AND INCITE WORLD OPINION AND WAR: SUCH AN EVENT COULD BE ANALOGOUS TO THE ENTIRE WORLD STEPPING ONTO A LANDMINE IN ONE ILL FATED MOMENT....

LET US PRAY FOR THE SAFETY OF THE "RACHEL CORRIE" FROM ANY ACCIDENTAL OR INTENDED HARM!

TODAY IS DAY 1469 SINCE GILAD SHALIT WAS KIDNAPPED AND MADE CAPTIVE IN GAZA BY HAMAS. SHABBATH SHALOM.

robdverity  06/04/2010 03:15 PM Report

LawrenceA - great points worth repeating, to whit: "Joe, maybe you have fond memories with Goldy Meir, but those days are gone Joe. I suggest you wake up to the reality of today. Israel is NOT our ally, never has been. We have used Israel as a listening post and a disruptive force in order to gain access to Middle East oil starting with the overthrow of the Iranian President in the 1950's. Israel has used us for military and economic aid plus vetoes of its taking of Palestinian land in the U.N. This has been the "special relationship" of the U.S.A. and Israel. But not a relationship that could be called "allies" Allies do not attack our Navy (Israel attacked the USS Liberty in 1967 killing 35 US Sailors - investigation was swept under the rug.) Allies do not run over American citizens with bulldozers, (Israeli army bulldozer crushed Rachael Corrie to death while defending Palestinian home from destruction) Allies don't bomb civilians with cluster bombs and white phosphorus. Allies of the United States don't embarrass our government by building fortresses on disputed land after being asked not to. U.S.A. Allies don't carry out apartheid policies on people unable to defend themselves."

NeilMac - Unfortunately the oil slime from the Gulf is intractable as that from Israel. Your suggested solution of "drop-in a large enough explosive charge to blow-back, crush, and permanently bury that death-spewing oil pipe under one-thousand tons of melted metal, fused sand, and crushed rock," has a doomsday ring that may be too apropos - even prophetic.

NeilMacCallister  06/04/2010 01:49 PM Report

Dear Mr. Vice-President Joseph Biden,

How many days would it take to drill a 100-foot deep hole in the vicinity of that disastrous Gulf oil well, and drop-in a large enough explosive charge to blow-back, crush, and permanently bury that death-spewing oil pipe under one-thousand tons of melted metal, fused sand, and crushed rock?

I would appreciate a timely response.

Thank you.

LawrenceA  06/04/2010 01:40 AM Report

Biden says the ships could have diverted to Israel and let Israel send the supplies to Palestine, "What's the big deal?" Joe the big deal is: Israel is not allowing more than the merest trickle of aid - just enough to claim they aren't starving these people to death which is why every country on the planet except our government, is attempting to send aid, or demand Israel lift the blockade.

Joe, maybe you have fond memories with Goldy Meir, but those days are gone Joe. I suggest you wake up to the reality of today. Israel is NOT our ally, never has been. We have used Israel as a listening post and a disruptive force in order to gain access to Middle East oil starting with the overthrow of the Iranian President in the 1950's. Israel has used us for military and economic aid plus vetoes of its taking of Palestinian land in the U.N. This has been the "special relationship" of the U.S.A. and Israel. But not a relationship that could be called "allies" Allies do not attack our Navy (Israel attacked the USS Liberty in 1967 killing 35 US Sailors - investigation was swept under the rug.) Allies do not run over American citizens with bulldozers, (Israeli army bulldozer crushed Rachael Corrie to death while defending Palestinian home from destruction) Allies don't bomb civilians with cluster bombs and white phosphorus. Allies of the United States don't embarrass our government by building fortresses on disputed land after being asked not to. U.S.A. Allies don't carry out apartheid policies on people unable to defend themselves.

And for Pete's sake Joe, how can you say you want Israel to make the investigation into this attack when the official Israeli response as well as your own, is a justification of what independent nations have called "Piracy on the High Seas?"

What's the "Big deal?" Joe? The big deal is Israel's attempting genocide of the Palestinian people and our government supports it.

My question to Joe Biden is: How many more Palestinians must die? How many more attacks on the U.S.A.? How many more American soldiers must die? How much further must we slide into debt before our government realizes it is supporting this genocide and the world won't stand for it?

I suggest Joe Biden and Charlie Rose and anyone interested to hear the full story take a look at what retired Army colonel and former US diplomat Ann Wright, who was a member of the flotilla has to say.

http://www.democracynow.org/2010/6/3/huwaida

pishro  06/03/2010 05:15 PM Report

why doesn't Mr Rose remind Mr Biden that when there was an inquiry into the Korean ship, it was the victim who was attached conducting the inquiry not the other way around? American media has shown an unprecedented byes on Israel so far over this incident and it is time to rethink this position, because it is starting to look like American position on Israel is disconnected from the reality that is getting more and more clear to the rest of the world.

Eric_R  06/03/2010 02:01 PM Report

Excellent interview as always. However, it drives me crazy when I hear solar panels, windmills, and efficient light bulbs mentioned as part of the solution to get us off of oil. We don't use oil for electricity. Those sources help to get us off of domestic coal. Coal has some environmental issues, but that is a different argument - nothing to do with oil.

robdverity  06/03/2010 01:57 PM Report

RE - seems to me we need to start thinking on the revenue side, namely (gasp, choke) taxes (TEA party be damned). If we weren't so corrupt and venal a fair tax - namely flat from say 15% to 20%?? - would be worthy of an attempt. However, big money would buy themselves exclusions and loopholes to the point of emasculating it. That being a hard reality, geometrically progressive taxes prob all that's left. Make them pay more for the bigger exclusions.

Understand our debt is like $44k per person. Two children families will be pushing $200k all too soon. Curtailing spending needs revenue as well. Elst the Yuan may become the only stable currency (on an increasingly unstable planet). However, even China may be smoke and mirrors more than currently evident. Too much US paper?

REMant  06/03/2010 12:43 PM Report

Okay, suppose Hamas IS at war with Israel. If, therefore, Israel has a right to know whether arms were on the ships to Gaza (they weren't), then Germany had a right to know whether arms were on the Lusitania (they were), and Britain to stop American shipping to France a century earlier. It remains to be seen if, provided it is not scrapped entirely, the healthcare act will actually reduce costs or reduce service or merely create inflation. There's no proof whatever that the employment situation has improved because of "stimulus" rather than simply direct government expenditure. Every road and bridge in the DC area seems to be under construction and I know Va and Md can't afford that. And for a debt-ridden people confidence can't possibly improve the situation alone, and most certainly not if the money they spend is borrowed from abroad or printed by the the central bank. And the banks paid back the money lent with depreciated Fed dollars. I would not call spending more money on people, confidence. It could just as well be called pacification, or patronage. We are did it in Iraq and now in Afghanistan. But even supposing that, because of our control of the world's currency, we can get away with it by passing the depreciation caused by it to everyone else, how long can we keep it up? How fair is it? And is it not in fact the cause of conflict in the first place?

T_Grant  06/02/2010 11:57 PM Report

I voted for Joe Biden in the primaries and have been a fan and admirer for YEARS!

I am also a supporter of Barack Obama and I am so grateful to have intelligent people of experience FINALLY in charge of our government!

Thank you Charlie Rose for having this articulate, intelligent and experienced man on your show. I know that many people are upset right now, but I agree with Mr. Biden that it is hard to argue with success, and I believe that the Obama/Biden has been remarkably successful, despite all the efforts to prove otherwise. Well done Obama/Biden administration...and thank you!

robdverity  06/02/2010 11:33 PM Report

Ole Joe's a loyal sheep dog type. Obama could have done worse. Defended Israel and put down Hamas despite his treatment during his trip. Interesting if true and not Israeli promoted BS, that Hamas intercepted shipments, warehoused them and sold them. Perhaps that would have been there ultimate end anyway, but Hamas doubtless profited. Rationalized I'm sure that it was for the greater struggle, as so many things are amongst warrior states.

Too bad all pols are tainted with perception of Israel's lobbying power. The corrosive corruption and venality of a system on the auction block for anything from financial reform (or not), unwanted MI investments (fighters, ships, etc), MMS oil fail-safe fac., SEC, FCC, EPA yadda, yadda is not above touting the narrative of the successful bidder.

It makes for a good throw-the-bums-out atmosphere, which with any luck will happen. Joe notwithstanding. Obama (disappointedly) needs ejecting as well. His soul was purchased by Robert Rubin, Citigroup, and Larry Summers during his campaign. Useless on finance reform and MI oligarchy (war) reform. Promotes drones which will come home to roost. The failed NYC bomber cited them. Childish! Drones have touted killing at least three number 2s and 3s al Qaedas over the last six months. Along with innumerable civilians of course, creating prob a 5:1 increase in recruits and hatred. CIA must train under Mossad.

Ricardo_Amaral  06/02/2010 10:31 PM Report

Joe Biden is among a very few politicians that I like in Washington. He always gave me the impression that he is a nice person.